Coradia Stream for NS/CFL/Trenitalia or niedersachsen

Dunkel alright, here's a question I can't seem to find an answer to. My train consists of 5 cars. The real ICNG 5 car set has 256 seats, so for ease I have given each car a PASSENGERS type cargo, and set CAPACITY to 52 for each car. To me 5 * 52 = 260. The in-game train of 5 cars says it has a capacity of 65 passengers, instead of 260. All my .mdl files list 52. Any idea what's going on there?

It's because the game divides by 4 the real capacity amount.

So 260 / 4 = 65

RaptorArk Thanks, did not know that.

Another thing I'm trying to figure out is how to get .dds files working. I can create the file format and pick various compression formats, such as the DXT1 format which should be supported by TF2. Whenever I load in a .dds file however, it does not respect the VU map. Using .tga does work however. Is there any reason my .dds files don't respect the UV map of the model?

EDIT: nevemind, I found out. So apparently .dds images need to be flipped vertically. Not something one would assume haha. All good now!

i've got the 8-car 3200 series modelled and textured. Also worked out how to convert to .dds textures and currenrly normal mapping the train. Small update pic below:

I've updated the front car with some additional detail and finished the normal maps for the entire consist. I've identified an issue with the UV maps on the carriages (front car seems fine), so I will have to correct that.

At the moment my list of fixes is getting short. There are some I could use some input on though, so if you know how please do let me know:

-fix UVs (should be quick).

-add soundset (haven't looked into this yet so can't say if I'll have trouble with it yet).

-create flashing red light above door on closing (have seen flashing doorlights on other mods, but can't seem to figure this one out. Does anyone here have any ideas?).

-the labels (displays on the train) work in the model editor but not in-game (not sure why. Does anyone know?).

-need to fix the fake bogies (I reckon I'll figure this one out, just have to get to it).

-add dirt/aging maps (should be fine here).

-correct the passenger numbers that the trainset can carry (what's the mod world consensus on this? Currently I have it so the carriages are set for 4x the real amount, so the in-game the numbers are correct. But in one of my games I use a doubling mod which makes it a bit excessive. Do we have a "modders protocol" of how many passengers we go with as a rule?).

-convert textures to .dds (I have figured out how to do this and it works. I will do this when I'm done with all the textures).

-remove the train driver character from a coupled set (what am I missing here?).

-create the Flow livery (that's just a diffuse map change, which shouldn't be too time intensive. I want to include this on release).

Here are some images of the model editor with the newly added details:

Zitat von TimothyS

(have seen flashing doorlights on other mods, but can't seem to figure this one out. Does anyone here have any ideas?).

Never done this but I assume this canbe done by an animation (scale to 0% or 100%) in combination with a door open/close trigger.

Zitat von TimothyS

Do we have a "modders protocol" of how many passengers we go with as a rule?).

There were discussions/questions in the past (e.g. RE: Richtlinie Anzahl Sitzplätze in Fahrzeugen) and there is no common "rule". I personally use the game logic (real capacity divided by 4). And you can always vary it a bit and, for example, count only seats or also standing room.

Zitat von TimothyS

-the labels (displays on the train) work in the model editor but not in-game (not sure why. Does anyone know?).

Example code/file would be good. Hard to tell but the editor often behaves a little bit different to the game. You are using the correct type for the label list?

Thanks Dunkel, that's very helpful. I had a read through the passenger amount thread just now and I guess I'll go 50/50 so the in-game train has half the capacity of the real one. I guess many people use mods that double that. In my game for example the 8-car set, with a doubling mod, has over 800 seats which is a bit excessive.

The animation suggestion might actually be exactly right. I was trying to reverse engineer the door lights on a Siemens C2 mod and noticed a lot of door variants, and I did think it was some "magic" with swapping out meshes. But I didn't consider scaling them. Great tip! I'll give that a try later.

As for the label, I'll double check. I know a mod where it works so I'll load that in and see if I can figure out what they've done versus what I've done. I'll be back with more details if needed. Thanks

Zitat von TimothyS

Dunkel alright, here's a question I can't seem to find an answer to. My train consists of 5 cars. The real ICNG 5 car set has 256 seats, so for ease I have given each car a PASSENGERS type cargo, and set CAPACITY to 52 for each car. To me 5 * 52 = 260. The in-game train of 5 cars says it has a capacity of 65 passengers, instead of 260. All my .mdl files list 52. Any idea what's going on there?

if you need my opinion, this is very likely due to how transport fever 2 is coded where 1 ingame passanger constitutes between 4 and 5 people IRL, that's all i managed to pick up from a minor amount of research, try increasing the number from 52 to something like 100 and see if that changes anything. i am however aware that there do exist mods that fix that that the users can download

Dunkel that tip about the animation was almost perfect - it does keep the light on when I leave the scale at 1 as standard. If I leave the scale as 0 as standard, it never shows up. Instead, I'm positioning it inside the mesh where it can't be seen, and move it to where it needs to be intermittently during the closing animation. Works like a charm!

I've made a short video showing the door closing light in action:

Just a little progress update from me:

I've managed to get the labels working. I had selected the wrong type previously, but now they show up nicely where they need to be on the train (side and front displays). It's set to display the line name.

I've also got the flashing lights working when the doors close, and built in a delay for the doors to give the lights some time to be seen. It involves animating the position of the light mesh in and out of the models. Interesting little technique. Thanks for the suggestion.

Sound wise I have a basic sound set going. I'm trying to reverse engineer an existing sound set to adapt it to my needs. From online videos of the ICNG I have been able to extract sounds for the horn, doors opening, doors closing and a sound for when the train pulls away. Unfortunately using this technique the horn sounds by default every time the train leaves a station. Very annoying. So I'll have to dig a little deeper into the various ways of getting sounds working, without it forcing the horn sound on station exit.

The bogies are now fixed and align properly. I had misunderstood the documentation (it's a bit vague and abstract) but managed to reverse engineer it from looking at other mods again. This is now done.

Some texture and shading tweaks are now complete. I'm happy with the way the train looks currently. I've created a separate texture for the head car of the 8-car set as opposed to the 5-car set. The 8 car sets have consist numbers in the 3200 range, while the 5-car sets are in the 3100 range. This is now accurately reflected in the texture of either set.

Additionally, I've completed the rust and dirt maps for both train sets, so when they age or are poorly maintained, that will start showing in-game.

Camera positions inside the train are now also present, so one can switch between various views when in camera mode. I just have to tweak the position a bit as the camera now initially ends up inside the mesh. Can be adjusted, but would be nice if it's correct from the start.

The next thing on my list then, aside from the sound set which I think might take some time figuring out, is to create the NS Flow livery.

More soon

Here's another quick update on the progress of the Flow livery. Head car is done, which is the hard part. I'll do the passenger cars over the next few days.

Amazing work man!

wait 4 it

I've completed the 8-car ICNG 3300 (ICNG-B) set. Here's a video of it (bit choppy unfortunately):

Dunkel what's your take on textures and their sizes? They're still TGA which I understand is heavier on VRAM (I will convert everything to .dds before release, it's just easier to stick with TGA while I'm working things up). Each car is on a 4k texture map. I've seen this in lots of other mods. I did try 2k but it gives me rather blurry lines. I'll read up a bit more to see what I can learn about optimising on that side of things. Would be good to hear from someone with more experience what the norms are regarding this sort of thing

EDIT: I've actually just tested a 1K texture map on one of the control cars (the most complex texture on the train) and it looks fine actually. I don't know why I remember even 2K was blurry...
That being said, some insight/advice on what the norms are for texture maps here would be very much appreciated. Below is an image of which the control car has a 1k texture map (instead of 4k).

It depends on many things. You could map one car to a 4K file or all 8 cars, so the pure size is relative. For one car I would say 4K is too much considering quality and resource usage. If 1K is enough for your livery great (my VRAM says "thank you"). But maybe there are other suitable liveries that would need more details?

I think looking on comparable vanilla vehicles is a good orientation. At least that's my idea to create mods that match the vanilla game (look/ressource usage). Btw. you can also consider using none square sizes (e.g. 2048x1024). For example Urban Games used a texture with 4096x2048 format for there brand new MAN 19.304 truck that containts all parts (incl. interrior, wheels, lights...). Older mods often use smaller sizes but e.g. wheels, lights have seperate textures. In the end, everyone has different demands on their mods. There is no "norm"...but: it's common and recommended from Urban Games to use DDS-Textures (https://www.transportfever2.co…sourcetypes#texture_files).

Many thanks Dunkel, I can see why your title says Unterstützer. That's all very helpful info. For example, I didn't consider the non-square option. My train cars can probably be fit into a half square, so I'll try that.

My in-game testing yesterday saw my VRAM choking up whenever that train passed by, and now that I've done some research on VRAM vs. texture sizes I understand why. Apparently a 1k texture takes about 3mb of VRAM while a 4k will take 72mb. Multiply that for every additional map such as Nornal, Cblend and Gloss, and off to the moon goes VRAM. I also didn't realise polygon count is apparently not *that* big of a deal, for VRAM at least.

I want my train to beautiful but I also don't want them to choke up performance so they can be enjoyed in large numbers. So thank you for your input and suggestions, it helps me get there :).

How many textures do you have per waggon?

4k shouldn't really affect the system to much in the current version. All Vanilla vehicles have 4k textures now.

And btw, Unterstützer is the title for the people that donated to keep TpF.net running

Oh cool, so you guys take donations to keep the whole thing up? I'd love to support that, this community has been very helpful in getting my mod working. I'd love to put my money where my train is. Where do I donate?

As for the textures, it's definitely not optimised at this moment. I was running a performance monitor when testing the ICNG-B set yesterday and my VRAM shot up from 4GB to 8GB (maxed out) and then the frame rate got really choppy. On other trains in the game it didn't seem to do that. But it makes sense as my texture use is lavish right now. But of course I was expecting to have to optimise that hence my testing and making sure I'm not killing people's GPUs. Before I got into special FX for film, I studied Game Art so I have mental markers of what's important, but the standards have changed a lot from ten years ago and of course technology has moved on, so I simply have lots to brush up on.

Here's what it looks like right now:

For each car, the roof elements take up one texture all together. These are shared across all cars though, so only one texture for all of those, but 4k right now. The pantographs and bogies share a texture, currently 4k currently as well, and also shared across the whole train, so one texture map for those. Then each car as an interior texture which is unique per car, currently a 4k map. All the normal, cblend and gloss maps are 4k too. The doors have their own textures but they're on a 512x512 map. Some doors appear multiple times in the train and will share a texture map.

I will go through them all and optimise it until I start seeing a marked difference in the quality of my textures. My wagons can fit two on one square. I can't seem to get half square maps working, they look scrambled, but I can combine two cars on a single square so I'll do that instead.

When I apply 2k textures to my cars I don't really see a big difference in the sharpness of the textures. With a 1k map I start seeing some jagged edges where lines curve for example, and the numbers on the textures become noticably blurry, but rather than a 4k map for each car, I can do two cars on a 2k map so that should save a fair amount. I can probably shrink the interior maps way further as they're just colours, so I'll look into that as well. So yeah, lots to optimise before I dive into the sound set.

I will have to adjust the UV maps for all cars (just shoving them around a little), re-export them and run them through the model editor to pick up the changes. Before I run any additonal liveries I will optimise the current train variants and make it all .dds maps as well, so I can test how that goes performance wise. I'm going to try and get that all done today.

I want to dive into the sound sets, as I'm really curious about how that works. I saw a tutorial from Marc which I have waiting for me to dive into.

This has become such a passion project, I love it. But so much to learn, and so much to do. Next time I make a "first mod" I'll start with a bus .

Ah, that explains it

Normally most of the things are on one uv map, not everything on a individual uv map.

As an example, my Wip EW IV coaches have this setup

A 4096*2048 Texture for the whole body with all details, including doors. Albedo, mgao, nrml, cblend

A 2048*2048 Texture for the interior, reused across multiple coaches. Albedo, mgao, nrml

A 512*512 texture for the bogies reused across all coaches. Albedo, mgao, nrml, cblend

Interior textures are the point where you can reduce the most. My EC coaches use a 1k interior texture and it's barely noticeable

Another update

I've completed the texture map optimisation, and converted everything to .dds format. The performance is a million times better. The trains no longer choke up my VRAM. Below is a video I recorded on my laptop save, where you can see there isn't much of a frame rate drop as compared to the previous video of the ICNG-B passing by for example. Do keep in mind that save game is in late game, with over 130 trains, 1000 road vehicles and trams and around a 100k population between my cities all being computed, so some choppiness is expected. It's not my ICNG mod causing it anymore